Contacting Pastoral owners???

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Contacting Pastoral owners???

Post by madmax800 on Wed 10 May 2017, 4:20 pm

Hi All,

Im wanting to contact a pastoral owner but do not know the persons name or address.

Is there any web sites that list this type of info.

Want to do as section 40 e states ..that is to contact the pastiral owner of my intentions to detect on his property.

Hope some one can help.

Thanks

madmax800
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Re: Contacting Pastoral owners???

Post by Bignuggs on Wed 10 May 2017, 5:37 pm

when you get your 40E from the DMP, you also get a copy to send/mail to the pastoral lease holder.
Applying online I'm not sure but if they have accepted your application then DMP have to tell you the contact details.
Cheers
Cliff

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Re: Contacting Pastoral owners???

Post by madmax800 on Wed 10 May 2017, 6:14 pm

Hi Cliff,

They have told me the station name and a PO box address but no phone number.

madmax800
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Re: Contacting Pastoral owners???

Post by matelot on Thu 11 May 2017, 6:00 am

i understand that when you send the station a copy of the 40E, then that is enough to satisfy the act. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

Regards Matelot/Roger

matelot


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Re: Contacting Pastoral owners???

Post by pilko on Thu 11 May 2017, 6:29 am

DMP are not allowed to give out phone numbers anymore....just name and service address.

pilko


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Re: Contacting Pastoral owners???

Post by madmax800 on Thu 11 May 2017, 7:56 am

So, Do I have to send a copy of the 40E to the station or jst contact them ??

Sorry, im still learning
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Re: Contacting Pastoral owners???

Post by matelot on Thu 11 May 2017, 10:40 am

send the paperwork.

Matelot

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Re: Contacting Pastoral owners???

Post by canetoad on Thu 11 May 2017, 10:58 am

Hi madmax800,

a list of WA pastoral lease holders is available at:

z4.ifrm.com/3711/27/0/p1006905/Pastoral_Contacts_W.A..xls

Includes phone numbers and email addresses where available. Not sure how up to date this is, but certainly provides a starting point.

canetoad


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Re: Contacting Pastoral owners???

Post by madmax800 on Thu 11 May 2017, 1:28 pm

Thanks for that
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Re: Contacting Pastoral owners???

Post by Chiv on Thu 11 May 2017, 8:38 pm

this list at least 1.5 years old on afew of the station that I know that has sold to new owners

Chiv


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Re: Contacting Pastoral owners???

Post by mada on Thu 11 May 2017, 9:24 pm

Chiv I think its closer to 3 years. One station I go to have been there coming into 3 years. Names are still of the previous holder. Pretty sure phone numbers dont change to much.

mada


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Re: Contacting Pastoral owners???

Post by araratgold on Fri 12 May 2017, 8:39 am

I sent an email to a station 4 weeks ago letting them know I would be on their station during June to September, didn't get even a courtesy reply !
Even though I have complied with my requirements, I kinda feel like I haven't !
Cheers,
Rick
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Re: Contacting Pastoral owners???

Post by mada on Fri 12 May 2017, 3:35 pm

Print copies and take them with you, if you get asked at least you can show you tried.

mada


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Re: Contacting Pastoral owners???

Post by pilko on Sun 14 May 2017, 7:09 am

also....you know that there is no requirement to contact a PLH.....

pilko


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Re: Contacting Pastoral owners???

Post by araratgold on Sun 14 May 2017, 7:44 am

pilko wrote:also....you know that there is no requirement to contact a PLH.....

Pilko,
Yes there is per the following :

Excerpt from Miners Right obligations :

Entry onto pastoral leases
(Refer to information pamphlet titled – Prospecting, Exploring, Mining on Pastoral Leases)
The holder of a Miner’s Right may pass or repass over any of the restricted land referred to above in order to gain
access to any other Crown land for the purpose of conducting activities allowed under a Miner’s Right
Before doing so, the holder of a Miner’s Right must take all reasonable and practicable steps to notify the pastoralist
(consent is not required) of their intentions and when passing or repassing shall :
i. take all necessary steps to prevent fire, damage to trees or other property and to prevent damage to any property
or livestock by the presence of dogs, the discharge of firearms, the use of vehicles or otherwise;
ii. cause as little inconvenience as possible to the pastoralist in relation to the passing and repassing;
iii. comply with any reasonable request made by the pastoralist in relation to the passing and repassing;
iv. restrict the number of passes or repasses to the minimum necessary for the purpose of mining on or marking
out that other land; and
v. make good any damage caused by the passing and repassing to any improvements or livestock on the land.

Cheers,
Rick
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Re: Contacting Pastoral owners???

Post by pilko on Sun 14 May 2017, 11:54 am

Hi Rick...yep...that is the most commonly misunderstood part of the mining act.
Unfortunately the DMP seem to do everything withing their powers to add to the confusion. The line you highlighted is only with regards to passing and re-passing within a distance of significant infrastructure such as a homestead....and if you read further the bit about obeying reasonable requests is only to do with passing and repassing. Bottom line is you have the same rights as a pastoralist if your prospecting legally. PLH's cannot use 'mustering' as an excuse to deny you access...in fact...they cannot deny you access full stop. I do believe common sense should rein..but unfortunately it usually does not. The problem we have is that groups like DMP with their misinformation...or to be more correct their ' careless handling of the truth' leads to prospectors not knowing the rules and PLH's not knowing the rules......by 'giving in' to PLH we as prospectors only give fuel to their fire. On the other side, so many prospectors are prospecting illegally and damaging infrastructure I can perfectly understand why a legitimate PLH doesn't want your guy's on their lease....remember though...they have no say in it.

pilko


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Re: Contacting Pastoral owners???

Post by pilko on Sun 14 May 2017, 12:04 pm

Hi Rick...I've done a cut and paste out of the Mining Act (1978) of the relevant section...as you can see if you read it...the notification etc is ONLY in regards to passing and repassing in some circumstances. Hope it's of interest to some.
Regards

Tony








(f) 100 m of any Crown land that is —
(i) for the time being under crop; or
(ii) used as a yard, stockyard, garden, cultivated field, orchard, vineyard, plantation, airstrip or airfield; or
(iii) in actual occupation and on which a house or other substantial building is erected; or
(iv) the site of any cemetery or burial ground;
or
(g) 400 m of any Crown land that is the site of any water works, race, dam, well or bore,
in order to gain access to other land (not being Crown land referred to in paragraph (f) or (g)), for the purpose of prospecting or fossicking on, exploring, mining on or under, or marking out that other land but a warden shall not give a direction under paragraph (ea) unless he is satisfied that the land is bona fide required for mining purposes and he is satisfied that compensation in accordance with section 123 for all loss or damage suffered or likely to be suffered by an owner or occupier of the land has been agreed upon or otherwise determined, or is assessed and settled in accordance with this Act.
(5a) The holder of a mining tenement or Miner’s Right who passes or repasses over any Crown land that is situated within —
(a) 100 m of any Crown land referred to in subsection (5)(f); or
(b) 400 m of any Crown land referred to in subsection (5)(g),
in order to gain access to the other land referred to in subsection (5) for the purpose referred to therein shall —
(c) before so passing or repassing, take all reasonable and practicable steps to notify the occupier of the Crown land so situated of his intention to do so; and
(d) when so passing or repassing —
(i) take all necessary steps to prevent fire, damage to trees or other property and to prevent damage to any property or damage to livestock by the presence of dogs, the discharge of firearms, the use of vehicles or otherwise; and
(ii) cause as little inconvenience as possible to the occupier of the Crown land so situated; and
(iii) comply with any reasonable request made by the occupier of the Crown land so situated in relation to the manner in which that holder so passes or repasses;
and
(e) restrict the number of occasions on which he so passes or repasses to the minimum necessary for the purpose of prospecting or fossicking on, exploring, mining operations on or under, or marking out that other land; and
(f) make good any damage caused by that passing or repassing to any improvements or livestock on the Crown land so situated,
and the occupier of the Crown land so situated is entitled to be compensated by that holder for any damage referred to in paragraph (f) that is not made good by that holder, and, in respect of land under cultivation, for any other loss or damage for which that holder is liable in accordance with section 123.

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Re: Contacting Pastoral owners???

Post by Nightjar on Sun 14 May 2017, 12:30 pm

After hearing (second hand) the negative response received from prospectors regarding Tarmoola Station I rang the owner/manager and had a conversation with him. He seemed to be a reasonable sort of fella and I can understand where he was coming from. Tourists/prospectors entering the land, shooting, LEAVING campfires burning & their rubbish behind.
Although we know it is not law, it is a matter of courtesy to contact lease holders. Win win situation.
I advised him we will be entering Tarmoola later in the year, he asked me to give him a call, which we will do.





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Re: Contacting Pastoral owners???

Post by araratgold on Sun 14 May 2017, 1:13 pm

Gidday Tony,

Thanks for that clarification !
I, probably like many, thought that passing / repassing meant driving around and / or camping on the station.

And as Peter says, a courtesy doesn't go astray anyway !
The last station owner we talked to back in 2013 was very helpful to my Dad and I, even showing us on a map where we could get some bore water for washing from.

Cheers,
Rick
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Re: Contacting Pastoral owners???

Post by madmax800 on Sun 14 May 2017, 2:25 pm

Rick, where do you get the pastoral holder email. ?
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Re: Contacting Pastoral owners???

Post by araratgold on Sun 14 May 2017, 4:53 pm

madmax800 wrote:Rick, where do you get the pastoral holder email. ?
Gidday John,
From the above listed link and the stations own website, sent them 2 emails, no reply !
Cheers,
Rick
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Re: Contacting Pastoral owners???

Post by Since1981 on Sun 14 May 2017, 8:05 pm

Another difficult aspect to all this is when you have tried multiple times to contact the pastoralist (fine if they don't reply - some must get 100s, but the clause in the Act is satisfied - "reasonable and practicable"), but when you arrive to get to your 40e site, the gates are locked and access is denied. I would never ever cut a fence or damage a gate, but where does that leave us?
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Re: Contacting Pastoral owners???

Post by Nightjar on Mon 15 May 2017, 7:27 am

Since1981 wrote:I would never ever cut a fence or damage a gate, but where does that leave us?

PL managers are not sitting home glued to their computers or listening for the phone, you need to try and contact them in the weeks leading up to your 40E commencement.
One owner and his wife I know personally run the station on their own. Between running the kids to school(40K away) and checking stock, tanks and bores they are rarely home.
The other factor is their is VERY limited mobile phone access.

Failed to mention in earlier post, another reason Pastoralists don't like unknown visitors. The moving trend in this era is to install solar bore pumps.
**You've guessed it** Thieving lowlifes steal them.










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Re: Contacting Pastoral owners???

Post by Since1981 on Mon 15 May 2017, 7:46 am

Agree absolutely, Nightjar. They are flat out doing their job and I respect that. I write in the months preceding and always contact, but, case in point is a station that has changed hands many months ago (one I have been to many times with great relations with the previous owner), there is now no phone number, no email address, the station has no-one on-site, but the access road gates are locked. I can assure you there's no solar on this property! Given that we have fulfilled all the provisions needed and do the right thing, is it right that access is denied by absentee owners?
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Re: Contacting Pastoral owners???

Post by araratgold on Mon 15 May 2017, 8:17 am

Since1981 wrote:Agree absolutely, Nightjar. They are flat out doing their job and I respect that. I write in the months preceding and always contact, but, case in point is a station that has changed hands many months ago (one I have been to many times with great relations with the previous owner), there is now no phone number, no email address, the station has no-one on-site, but the access road gates are locked. I can assure you there's no solar on this property! Given that we have fulfilled all the provisions needed and do the right thing, is it right that access is denied by absentee owners?

Good point ? Where does the law stand in regards to locked gates blocking access to miners ?
Where would a miner stand if he did cut a lock ?
Like Since1981, I don't want to resort to cutting a lock, but under the Mining Act with your Miners Right you have a right also to access a station, which is after all only leased from the Government, and is considered Crown Land under the Mining Act ????
Cheers,
Rick
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